Jake Baadsgaard, founder of Disruptive Advertising, is very selective about who he works with. In fact, after they go through his vetting process, only about 20% of potential clients make the cut.
He breaks down what makes a client a good fit and how he and his team figure it out. It’s a key part of a well-oiled business development machine they’ve put into place.
Disruptive Advertising does no outbound marketing of its services. We find out why they don’t need to and get all the details on the other seemingly counterintuitive strategies they use on a daily basis.
Tune in to find out…
- Ways to deal with unrealistic expectations from clients
- How many companies are sabotaging their Facebook marketing – and don’t even know it
- Two reasons for price objections and how to handle them
- The right way to use marketing automation
- And more
Mentioned in This Episode: Disruptiveadvertising.com
Steffen Horst: Welcome to the Performance Delivered, Insider Secrets for Digital Marketing Success podcast, where we talk with marketing and agency executives about how they built successful businesses in their personal brand. I’m your host, Steffen Horst. Today I’m happy to have as our guest Jacob Baadsgaard. Jake is the CO and founder of Disruptive Advertising, a PPC agency that has rapidly grown since it was founded six years ago. Disruptive works with companies like Guitar Center, Panimac, and Bloom to mention just a few. Jake, great to have you on the show.
Jake Baadsgaard: Thanks for having me.
Steffen Horst: Jake, before we start talking about how to grow an agency from a one man operation to a thriving agency, I would really love to hear how did you get started in digital marketing?
Jake Baadsgaard: Yeah, you bet. My introduction into digital marketing is a little different. I did not get a marketing degree or ever anticipate that I would be working in marketing. Never even considered it for that matter. I got a degree in information systems, a little bit more technical in nature. I took a job with a local, booming company called Omniture at the time, that was later bought by Adobe. They hired me for my technical abilities.
So I actually helped companies implement site catalyst, now Adobe Analytics, as their analytics solution on their websites, and help deploy the code and the tracking, and solutions in place to help fortune 500, 100 companies get good web data. The interesting part of that is over time, a lot of these companies would engage me to help analyze and gather insights from that data, and give their marketing team recommendations. What I found over and over again was that I would find opportunities with, hey, these keywords, you’re spending a lot of money on these, and yeah, they drive conversions, but it’s not actually translating into revenue for your business. I’d recommend spending your budget over here, or over there, and pulling back in these areas. Little by little I just started getting exposed to digital marketing, especially on the PPC side of things, where it was the easiest to track performance and what was going on. So that’s how I got introduced to PPC marketing, and what kind of got me started down that path.
Steffen Horst: Oh, great, that’s interesting. I remember the time of Omniture, back in the day, before it got bought by Adobe. So when you worked for Adobe, your LinkedIn profile says as a senior digital marketing consultant, was there a particular moment when you thought, you know what? With all the data that this analytics system collects, and the obvious blindness of companies to read the data correctly and then make adjustments in order to get a greater return on investment or return on advertising spend, why am I not founding my own company? Was there that particular moment where you made that decision?
Jake Baadsgaard: You know, it was … I would say it was more of a progression. I actually thought that … I did plan at breaking off on my own at some point, and I actually just thought I would do freelance analytics consulting. That’s what I thought I would be doing. So I actually took a job outside of working there, and had a very open relationship with my boss and said, hey, I do plan to start at least consulting at an agency at some point. He was open and okay with that. That way, because I did have a non-compete for a year after I left, and I wanted to make sure I honored that. So in the meantime, after I went through that process, and then did start to get some analytics contracts, I just ran into the same thing, which was I would find the insights, and they didn’t have the ability to act on those, either due to bandwidth issues or they just didn’t have the technical ability. So I’m like, well, I’ll do it for you. That’s why I started to do more fulfillment and execution on the actual PPC side of the business.
Steffen Horst: Interesting. So a few minutes ago you said you don’t have the typical kind of someone studies marketing or digital marketing, moves in, starts as a PPC coordinator or digital coordinator. Did you teach yourself the PPC management and Facebook marketing skills?
Jake Baadsgaard: I did. Just trial and error, and bouncing ideas off of other people in the industry. Definitely learned the most from my mistakes, and found a lot of wins, too.
Steffen Horst: Interesting. So when was it, then, that you decided to found your own agency? Did you start off with being the only person in that construct? Or did you start off with having a partner or several people that worked with you?
Jake Baadsgaard: Yeah. So I had a … So in between leaving and working for this other company outside of Omniture, I also had a short lived whole selling business, that actually, it was a software that eventually moved to the Cloud and removed me from that. But, made a decent amount of money in a short amount of time that kind of put me in the position that I felt comfortable breaking off and starting a business. So I kicked that off in September of 2013, and at the time I did have a business partner, someone that I had been interacting with for a while, and got going with him. Realized pretty quickly, for no fault of his or mine, that it just wasn’t the right fit from a partnership standpoint. So literally two months into it we did end that professional relationship and kind of moved our separate ways for a variety of reasons.
Steffen Horst: Okay. So you mentioned that you started off with a lot of analytics work. How did you get your first advertising client? Was there a kind of progression out of you analyzing their data and then going to them with suggestions? Then basically upselling that you could actually also do the management of the campaigns?
Jake Baadsgaard: Yeah. That was the situation with my first two clients. Then after that, people started coming to me and I’d position myself as well, to just start directly with Google Ad Words, primarily, at the time. So yeah, that’s how it started with the first two contracts, but then beyond that, it moved pretty quickly into a PPC focus.
Steffen Horst: So many companies or many people have always the problem that they start off as a one man show, and then growing from there, while in this case paid media, how did you go about to growing your client base while being a one man operation?
Jake Baadsgaard: Well, by the time I got the business going, and by that, I mean when I discontinued my full time employment, at that time I already had a decent sized book of business that allowed me to hire someone right out of the gate. In fact, I did that before I even formally launched Disruptive Advertising with my initial business partner. The way that I got my clients was just through my personal network and referrals, and I went to networking events, and just kind of hustled, you know? Just networked, talked to people, figured things out, wasn’t afraid to reach out to people in LinkedIn, and got our first, probably my first 20 to 30 clients that way. Did all of the fulfillment myself, then eventually hired someone that I knew to help me with that at an hourly rate. That’s when I decided to do it full time, and just formally get the business going. That’s how we kind of got things off the ground. First clients were just personal clients and just hustling.
Steffen Horst: Okay. So when you started off picking up clients, did you set yourself kind of a minimum fee level that they would have to pay, or a minimum spent level? Or were you just happy to build a book of business, doesn’t matter what their investment or their fee is that you would get out of it?
Jake Baadsgaard: Well, I wanted to make sure that I could help them succeed and that it was worth my time. So my first couple of clients actually had pretty large budgets in the hundreds of thousands of dollars per month. I think that because of my background in enterprise experience they felt pretty confident in working with me, for a lot of people just starting out don’t necessarily have that background. So my first couple of clients had large budgets. But then I also took on quite a few with smaller budgets as well. I believe at the time the minimum that I was charging was about 1,000 bucks per month to manage that. Yeah. We played around with that. Yeah. That’s about where it was.
Steffen Horst: I assume over time you kind of increased that and adjusted it based on the demand and the goal of the company?
Jake Baadsgaard: Well, actually, today we work with … So we’ve got about 120 people in the company now. We service about 500 accounts.
Steffen Horst: Wow.
Jake Baadsgaard: But in particular industries, we’ll actually service those at like $500 a month, because we’ve got a really tried and true strategy that is easy for us to implement and deploy for them, even with small budgets. Then in other industries we don’t want to touch anything that’s less than $20,000 a month in spend, because we just know that it’s going to be hard to be successful if we try to go any less on that.
Steffen Horst: I see what you’re saying. So I would assume dental practices or something like that, they probably don’t spend tens of thousands of dollars if they are one location practice. For them, you create a campaign structure, a system that works quite well for one, and that can be replicated for other clients, therefore a lower fee. You still make a decent amount of profit off that client, basically.
Jake Baadsgaard: Correct.
Steffen Horst: Yeah. After doing all the hustling of the bringing people in, obviously the responsibility to make sure that you can pay everyone at the end of the month increases. Have your business development efforts changed over time? So from you going out at networking events, reaching out on LinkedIn to where you are now? If so how?
Jake Baadsgaard: So right now, we run … We do almost no outbound efforts anymore. We do … Sometimes we’ll attend conferences for fun, and still go to some networking events locally. But that’s almost a non-factor in the business at this point. We’ve just taken the time to develop our site authority, we’ve invested years and thousands of articles into our blog. We spend a lot of media with both search, social, video, and promoting ourselves and having good nurturing and retargeting campaigns. So we’ve just got a pretty well balanced marketing strategy at this point and have quite a few companies reaching out to us every month.
Steffen Horst: How does that look like, let’s say after hustling, what was the first next business development activity you did? You mentioned looking at your website, you have a huge amount of articles. But what was the next business development activity you basically implemented after getting off the ground?
Jake Baadsgaard: Well, the next strategy was, from an inbound standpoint, I needed to have a team in place to do that anyway. So, while we were still doing a lot of the networking, working from client referrals, getting some organic traffic and paid traffic to the site, what we needed to do next was actually get someone on the cell side up to speed that could close involved. Right? So that was really the next step. After a couple of failed attempts with higher, more experienced people that I could just hand that off to, I ended up just hiring someone that was more junior, but kind of come off of a couple of sales floors and was good.
I used some people in my company, and wanted to be here, and was very persistent in making sure that he got a job. I said, okay, awesome. He came on board, and we kind of just worked together for a year, where I helped, he just kind of came along with me while I closed the deals, he supported me. He started working on some of the smaller ones himself. Then eventually just got him up to speed. Once that happened, as well, it actually happened with a couple of individuals, then that’s when I actually started investing more in content, more in our own page search and social advertising. I’d actually start to feed them leads regularly so that we could actually start to have consistent quotas and sales each month.
Steffen Horst: That makes sense. I know from my own experience, but also from talking to other people, finding that sales person that can actually do the job is quite difficult. From your experience, what are … What does someone need to have to be successful in sales and digital marketing, from the perspective … They need to understand digital marketing? Is that something that you look for? Or do they need to have certain characteristics in order to be successful?
Jake Baadsgaard: So the people on my team, the less experienced sales team members are going to follow a pretty specific questionnaire to identify if it’s even a good fit for us to consider working together. That’s what the junior roles will do. My senior team members that are actually putting together the strategy, the audits, the proposals, and closing the deals, all have at least some experience doing the actual digital marketing, and take very seriously being abreast and up to speed with what’s going on in the industry, the way the strategies, and are just fantastic marketers themselves. So I do, at least personally, think that if I’m going to sell something, I should understand it, and understand how it’s going to apply for our clients. So our people that are closing the deals, it takes a long time to develop and get them to that point. But I think that because of that, that’s where they do such a great job and positioning things for success for both ourselves and for the client.
Steffen Horst: Mm-hmm (affirmative). So the senior guys, they close the deal. How do you use the junior ones? What other tasks or responsibilities do they have to take care of in order to feed the machine?
Jake Baadsgaard: Yeah, so we have enough demand from just inbound leads that it keeps them busy. We have a 17 touch points for any inbound lead that comes in. They follow that program, with all the leads that are coming in. Then we just hire based on lead volume and demand that’s coming in. But that’s all they do, they just screen the inbound leads that are coming in.
Steffen Horst: So talk about the screening. What does that include? What are you looking for to define whether a lead makes it to the next step?
Jake Baadsgaard: Yeah. Some of the obvious things that we’re tactful about getting to, such as what are your goals and objectives? Do you have realistic expectations? What’s your budget to accomplish those goals and objectives, and is that even realistic? What’s the timeframe that you’re expecting results and success in? What do results need to look like before you’re willing to increase your budget? Do you have the bandwidth and ability to fulfill on product or services if we do drive additional business for you? If so, how? How is that going to scale? How is that going to work? So we just go up through a variety of questions like that to just understand … We like to work with businesses that are interested in growth, that have at least reasonable expectations that we can work with, and that have a product and a service that we feel like we can actually be successful with. We’re never …
Well, in some industries we’re 100% that we’ll be successful with them. But we try to be pretty transparent. If we feel like there is less than a 50% chance that we’ll be successful with them, we’ll just tell them that and say we’re probably not the right fit. Some still want to make it work, and we’ll figure out if that makes sense. But for the most part, we just try to be pretty straight up and ask the questions that allow us to tell them, this is what you should expect from us, and this is what we can realistically do. A lot of the businesses just really express their appreciation around the thought and detail that we put into the strategy, the recommendations, and frankly telling them whether or not we’re a good fit for them. We tell 80% of the businesses that reach out to us that we’re not a good fit.
Steffen Horst: We work in a similar way here. But I, having talked to a lot of clients, I think there are a lot of clients out there that wish that they would get that direct communication rather than someone sugarcoating it and saying, they can deliver on the results the client would like to achieve, although it obviously is completely unrealistic. With prospects that you guys work with, when you go to a point, and maybe that now is different to two or three years ago, but what were the most common objections that you heard from prospects in regards to the fee that they might have to pay, in regards to suggestions? How did you guys counter them, or how did you counter them?
Jake Baadsgaard: You know, we’re never the cheapest option. We’re not always the most expensive either. We’re usually kind of in the upper middle in terms of how we’ve positioned our price points. At least that’s how it’s typically been, kind of on the higher end of middle. When there is price objections, it’s usually for two reasons. One of them is we haven’t done a good job of positioning value, or the other problem is they just don’t have the budget to really work with us.
So what we really try to make sure that we understand is, hey, this is the solution that we feel like is going to best meet your needs. How confident do you feel that this is the right direction for your business? This is the price point that it would take us to service that. How do you feel like that aligns with the value that you’d be getting for that? So we just ask them straight up so that we can understand where their concerns are. Most of the time it either just highlights that we’re not the right fit or we didn’t do a good job of establishing value, because I think one of the biggest challenges in our industry is people underselling to get the contract, and then they can’t allocate the appropriate time and resources to get the results that are needed.
Then everybody leaves feeling like they lost in the relationship when it ends, versus hey, maybe we close a little less, but we position it in a way where our chances of being successful are pretty high. Just making sure we do a good job of explaining that. But price is definitely one. The other thing that we really try to understand is just expectations around if you’re going to pick up the phone and call us four times a day, and you want to do that for $2,000 a month, like, hey, this just isn’t going to work, right? We need you to trust us, we need you to be reasonable in your communications. If you’re going to freak out when we haven’t doubled your business in 30 days, let’s just not work together please.
Steffen Horst: That makes total sense. I think we all don’t like the clients that are impatient and want to get results tomorrow, but don’t want to pay what it requires to do that, not that it’s possible, usually, to turn an account around within one or two days. So as you’ve done a lot of business development activities to go from being a single operation to, you said earlier, 120 men and women agency. The business development efforts that you did, what were the ones that you tried and that did not work?
Jake Baadsgaard: You know, one of the ones that we haven’t been able to quite figure out in terms of being able to be consistent in volume is through conferences. We’ve sponsored a handful of conferences, we regularly speak at conferences, and it’s just not one that we’ve chosen to invest a lot in because we just haven’t been able to find the consistent results that we’re looking for there. Not only just the cost, because just the cost of sponsoring or doing or attending these conferences is not that bad. It’s the opportunity cost, it’s the amount of days and effort that go into that versus continuing to push on our own marketing efforts and driving that demand. So that’s one that we’ve just struggled with, and quite frankly, I don’t know that we’ll pursue much other than conferences that we like to be at for reasons of learning, and networking, and being there beyond just business development.
Steffen Horst: Do you think it is because it’s kind of a congregation of agencies that all have the same goal, right? They’re networking, but they’re also going in order to, with the hope of picking up new clients and it’s just too dense?
Jake Baadsgaard: I think that’s part of it. But we’ve gone to conferences where there is a lot of agency representation, and conferences where there is almost no agency representation. I just don’t know that it’s … We get clients from it, we get sales from it. But when I look at dollar for dollar and effort for effort that we get from our inbound marketing efforts, it just doesn’t scale and pay back as well.
Steffen Horst: Okay. So it’s a question of the return on advertising, basically.
Jake Baadsgaard: Yeah. Probably even more important than the dollars, it’s the time invested, which you could tie back to a dollar amount, I guess.
Steffen Horst: I was just about to say, it all comes back to money, right? So conferences, not so good from return on advertising or return on investment perspective. But what has worked, what works really well? What worked well in the beginning when you started? I think you mentioned earlier the hustling and kind of the networking. What works now really well for you that you’re a much bigger agency?
Jake Baadsgaard: It’s all the same things, just at more scale. We produce more content than we’ve ever produced. We spend more marketing dollars than we ever have on paid search, lead targeting, social media advertising, and video and media placements and those types of things. We spend about 100, $120,000 a month in marketing. So we do invest quite a bit in that. We do drive in quite a few leads every month. That’s, again, we’re not really doing it a whole lot different other than just that greater scale. Of course, we’ve found efficiencies for things that tend to convert more for us.
Steffen Horst: Okay. So where are you now? Obviously I would assume that you kind of pulled yourself out of the day to day pain optimization, selling part. But at what point in Disruptive growing did you realize that you need to step out of the day to day and need to focus more on growing the agency? What did you do in order to be able to do that?
Jake Baadsgaard: Well, there is a lot of things that … In terms of the day to day optimizations, that’s accurate. I’m still involved in the strategy and closing down the larger engagements, and making sure that we’re aligned for success. I still do a lot of trainings. But I think that really it’s just kind of a natural progression. I think that it’s one that it’s hard to accelerate, I feel like we’ve gone through it pretty quickly, but at the end of the day, we’re making hires, and it just takes time for them to get there, the foundation, to get really competent in the platforms that way that we do it. It’s interesting, we’ll hired experienced people, but we just do things differently.
To get aligned there, and to communicate the way that we know how to work best with our clients, it takes a while to get people to that point. So sometimes it just takes people 12, 18, 24 months before they’re really solid, and rocking and rolling, and you can trust them to just be running with it. So it’s just been a progression of going through that first generation of employees and getting them to a good spot. Now that generation is getting the next generation to a good spot. Same thing on the sales side of things. So I would say generally speaking, it’s just been a natural progression as the average skillset and competency progresses within the company.
Steffen Horst: Okay. You mentioned earlier that the first partner that you had teamed up with, after two months you had separated. Who did you hire then as kind of the next first person to work with you? What is your recommendation for someone that is a one man operation, it’s on the brink of I have to bring in the next person to kind of allow for growth, what should they look out for?
Jake Baadsgaard: Well, I think that a lot of what it comes down to is people … We try to look for the easy way out. So we want to hire someone that can do all of it for us, and that’s just not realistic. If I did it all over again, I would have just gone a little bit slower, and I would have hired someone that at least had the potential and ability to become strong technically first, to do the fulfillment execution and driving results in the account, and taking the time to get them to a really good spot.
Sometimes those people can be great client communicators as well, sometimes not. But I would start with just, hey, let’s get someone up to speed that can actually make sure none of the balls get dropped, and the execution and operations are happening the way that they need to. Just getting someone really, really good there, because investing that time with that first person, and getting them really strong is going to pay big dividends, because then they’ll be able to help do that with the next person, and the next person. Rather than trying to expect them to be good at everything.
I would even argue that … I would exercise caution even in the number of platforms that one is willing to service for a client, because that’s hard to train someone to be fantastic in Google Ads as well as Facebook Ads, in addition to understanding on page experience, and what effective image and motion ads look like that engage, and copy writing and all of those things. It’s … I think just stay focused and take your time going through that process. I think for the most part, we did that. Early on in the business we really focused on Google Ads and landing pages to help those clicks convert. Then branched out into social, and some site testing, and some other things that we do now as an organization. But we really waited until we were solidified in one area before expanding from there. I think that’s where a lot of people get caught up is trying to do too much too soon.
Steffen Horst: That’s a good point, actually. The next question I have for you is actually along that. What do you do when you have a client that you already service from a paid search perspective, paid social perspective, do some landing page optimization or creation, and they all of a sudden want to have SEO, email marketing, programmatic media buys, direct buys? What are you guys doing, what have you done in the past and what are you doing now in order to either fulfill what they need or how do you deal with that?
Jake Baadsgaard: Well, the answer, to me, is simply this, is it a service that we can effectively provide to at least 80% of our clients?
Steffen Horst: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Jake Baadsgaard: If the answer is no, this is just kind of a one off situation, or maybe here and there, the answer for us it just no, we’re not going to do it. If it’s one that we say, actually, we would like to do this for 80% of our clients, and we feel like we can do it well, let’s run a couple of pilots, that’s how we’ve addressed it in the past. That’s how we got …
Initially, the vast majority of our revenue was tied to Google Ads. Now it’s about 50% of our revenue is tied to Google Ads. I expect that as a percentage to continue to decrease as we’ve gone through those pilots, social now represents a large part of the business, and optimization is now a big part of the business, analytics and data insights, email, those types of things. That’s how I look at it. If I could do it for 80% of my clients and do it well, or at least I think I could, then I’m willing to pilot it and then go from there. The reality is we didn’t even start expanding our offerings until we had probably 30 or 40 employees.
Steffen Horst: Interesting. I think we’re kind of going towards the end of the podcast. So I have two more questions for you. The first one is how do you stay up to date? Earlier you mentioned going to network events, going to conferences. Are there any particular online sources that you frequently look at in order to see what is the latest and greatest?
Jake Baadsgaard: Well, selfishly I think our own blog is one of the best resources out there, because it’s based on what’s really happening with our clients and what we’re seeing going on in the market. So that’s, we invest a lot in that. It’s not just for … It’s all public, but it’s also for internal use, so that employees can stay up to speed and know what each other are doing, and what’s working and what’s not, and what used to work and what doesn’t work anymore, and those kind of things. But for me, personally, I shifted into working a lot more on leadership development, the processes of the company, our own marketing efforts.
So that’s where I’m spending a lot of my time. I listen to usually about two books on Audible a month. I like to read a lot of articles, I like to do a lot of those types of things. I’ve always had a business coach since the first few months of the business. I’ve found tremendous value in that. Now I’ve got a CFO and a finance team, but early on I also had a finance coach that took the time to help me understand the numbers really well on how to be disciplined, and learning the business. That’s one of the things that I’m focused on. Internally, we have our own proprietary training program content articles, and we’ve got an internal network called the Grid is how we get everybody up to speed, and keep things fresh and real. But then we also follow industry stuff. We’ve always enjoyed, I follow the unbalance blog and the word stream blog, and some Neal Patel stuff, and a lot of those things as well.
Steffen Horst: From your perspective, where do you see the next opportunity, it might not be on the PPC side, for companies to increase marketing efforts or to use a new channel to drive additional business? Is there anything, from your perspective, out there that is flying under the radar at the moment but might come up over the next two or three years?
Jake Baadsgaard: Well, I’ll give you the boring answer first, and then we can talk about some things that I see coming down the pipeline. The boring answer is so we’ve developed an audit and recommendation software tool that we use. We use it in our sales process and then we use it for the ongoing monitoring and management of all of our accounts. That way we make sure all the right things are happening, and that accounts are performing where they need to be.
Number one thing … We’ve now done, I believe, over 6,000 audits that we’ve got documented.
Number one thing that we’ve seen is budgets are used poorly. In that, if we think specifically on Google, and this also applies to Facebook, but we’ll talk about Google first, I’m spreading my budget out too thin. I don’t even know it’s actually working, because I’m running into my budget runs out at 11 AM because I spread it out so thin, and my top and bottom performers turn off at the exact same time. So budget utilization is the number one thing that I see companies doing wrong. Just making some simple changes there, they can either drive the exact same results at a fraction of the budget, or they can drive dramatically better results at the same budget.
So that’s what we’ve seen, kind of the blocking and tackling just proper account structure and budget allocations. When that’s done, the companies that we work with see dramatic lift. The same thing exists on the Facebook side of things, where too many people are testing really broad, not very many audiences with not very much creative. When you think about that, that’s like putting all of your eggs on two keywords with two ads and hoping that your Ad Words account works. With Facebook, if you test two audiences with two ad creatives, that’s like the same thing. What we see most businesses doing wrong there is why not be testing 20 audiences with 20 creative, and now you’ve just given yourself 400 opportunities to win, to find something that works, so long as the budget permits it, right? We don’t want to stretch the budget out too much there.
So those are the things that I see from a blocking and tackling fundamentals, that people need to get on top of. The other thing that we’re seeing is that a lot of the automation software that’s out there currently is somewhat quickly becoming obsolete with smart bidding within Google on a variety of things, shopping, display, some of those things, where we’re just not seeing third party platforms outperform those anymore, or manual optimizations. So I think that the opportunity from an agency side, and internally from a marketing manager, director type position is the real value of the marketer is not in the ability to change a bid. It’s not in the ability to rotate out an ad to test. Those are the basics, and they should be automated over time. If the big boys don’t do it, I’ll do it, right?
It should be automated, because that’s just the basics of what should be happening. The focus should be on strategy, and understanding what buyer personas drive the best lifetime value at an appropriate acquisition cost, and focusing, finding the right types of customers more, and figuring out how to give them a better experience, and get them to buy again and more. Rather than just trying to be a solution for everything in the industry, and taking a lot of the crappy and the good customers at the same time, focus the dollars on where it matters. That’s the part that I think just internally in a marketing position or at an agency, that’s where the value is currently, and will continue to be independent of all of the machine learning and artificial intelligence that is flooding into the market right now, because it’s just automating what should be automated. It’s not replacing good marketers. It’s just replacing bad marketers that are just doing the basics and want to get paid for doing light manual labor type things, and the accounts that just don’t need to be a part of that anymore.
Steffen Horst: That’s a great point. Love to talk more about that, but unfortunately we’ve come to the end of the podcast. Jake, great to have you on the show. Love your answers. If someone, if a company needs help with their PPC campaigns, how can they get in touch with you?
Jake Baadsgaard: Yeah, I mean, easiest way is just go to Disruptiveadvertising.com, reach out to us, we’ll be glad to run our audit tool for you, and just give you some free pointers and direction on your Google or Facebook accounts. Then if we were the right fit to work together, great, if not, we’d just love to see people be successful in their accounts.
Steffen Horst: Great. Thanks everyone for listening. If you liked the Performance Delivered podcast, please subscribe to us and leave us a review on iTunes or your favorite podcast application. If you want to find out more about Symphonic Digital, you can visit us at Symphonicdigital.com or follow us on Twitter @SymphonicHQ. Thanks again and see you next time.